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sdillen
04-03-2007, 12:57 PM
Apparently they called for volunteers while I was out of the room and as a result I'm now the president of the Four Wheel Drive Association of BC.

I'm trying to wrap my mind around what's broken and what's working in the Association. I realize that we've been essentially a non-entity over the last many years and hope to change that. Here are my thoughts and initial direction for this year.

1. Fix our finances. We've spent a lot of money for years without much to show for it.
2. Increase awareness of who/what we are.
3. Retain membership -- frankly, there's been a mass exit from the association over the last few years....completely the association's fault.
4. Increase membership. I think this will come from actually doing what people want us to do.

So -- What do you want the Four Wheel Drive Association to do for you?

For me, I want the 4wdabc to be respected in the 4x4 community and by government/business (I have a LOT of work to do here). I also want the association to be an active participant in keeping trails open -- and to deal with the politics that nobody really wants to deal with. Basically for the association to go off and do the member's bidding while the members go wheeling.

I welcome your comments. Either here or directly (4wdabc@telus.net). Help me build whatever it is you're looking for.

Murd0c
04-03-2007, 01:14 PM
[cheers] seems like theres been a huge direction of change the past 1 1/2 years. Towards the right thing to do. Of course we don't want trails shut down but it seems like certin trails/camping spots are too easy to get a car into that people will burn/leave there.

Use hale/davis As a example. They should make them only 4x4 accessable so we won't have to worry as much about the idiots going down there making a mess etc.

just a little idea but keep up the good work [cheers]

sdillen
04-03-2007, 01:30 PM
Use hale/davis As a example. They should make them only 4x4 accessable so we won't have to worry as much about the idiots going down there making a mess etc.

The one advantage we have with some of these spots is the simple fact that nobody has money to maintain the roads! Take Chehalis FSR for example....I understand that the current washout will not be repaired as repair comes with a $100k price tag which the MOF is unwilling to foot. As a result, Chehalis West is only accessible via Mystery Creek....which means for 6 months of the year it's only 4x4 access (and for 2 months it's probably sled access only!)

Hale....no road improvements will happen there. No road >removal<, but no road improvements. So....this spring should set the tone of that trail for the summer. The creek crossings on the North Road are starting to push the limits of stock vehicles so I don't expect as much traffic down there this year. The South Road is getting to be kind of fun in spots. On our monthly trips up there, we've had more than a few drive down the south road to the obstacle, then turn around and go back up and around to the North Road.

Putting it bluntly, the 4WDABC is NOT interested in road "improvement". We ARE interested in attracting more 'mainstream' 4x4 access to back country and into our membership....as a result, I'm pursuing adoption of what I consider to be 2wd accessible rec sites this year.

Honky
04-03-2007, 02:18 PM
This is GREAT news!! Your right the Four Wheel Drive Association has been nothing but a money grab/ do nothing association for as long as I can remember. I really like what you/the 4WDABC has done with Hail creek and this has changed my views completely. With you at the helm it looks like the right direction has been found!

One thing I see that needs to be addressed or at least looked at is the forests and range Minister Rich Coleman, Forests and Range Statutes Amendment Act.

In The Zone
04-03-2007, 02:25 PM
chehalis south is in need of some good washouts as well considering the winds have pretty much destroyed the sites there.


this is a good thing..

i feel there needs to be more positive involvment withte 4x4 community in policing the areas where dumping and vandals run amuck as the local police seem to have theor hands ful with vi's and the other related crap...

J20
04-03-2007, 02:34 PM
keep up the good work steve with you in control hopefully you can renovate the 4wdabc

MikeWild
04-03-2007, 06:29 PM
Just curious, when you say:

We ARE interested in attracting more 'mainstream' 4x4 access to back country and into our membership

What is your idea of 'mainstream'?

ray
04-03-2007, 06:46 PM
well i would say support your member as much as possilble

i have tryed to get in but i simply never get an email or anything saying i can join

where as every other club i go to im fine but its only yours

so im not happie but shit happens

sdillen
04-03-2007, 06:56 PM
Just curious, when you say:

We ARE interested in attracting more 'mainstream' 4x4 access to back country and into our membership

What is your idea of 'mainstream'?

I look at it as there are two types of 'wheelers. Those who view 4x4 as a means of transportation to their chosen recreation and those of us who view 4x4 AS the recreation. I think clubs and forums like this cater to those of us in the second group -- at the expense of somewhat excluding those in the first group.

There are a lot of people out there who use 4x4 to get to their fishing spots...to go sledding....to drop their ATV off at the trailhead, etc. I think the Association needs to recognize these individuals...

Honky
04-03-2007, 09:30 PM
There are a lot of people out there who use 4x4 to get to their fishing spots...to go sledding....to drop their ATV off at the trailhead, etc. I think the Association needs to recognize these individuals...


?????? are you saying that the association is looking for membership from people that have 4X4 on the side of their street truck?

Cheeky
04-03-2007, 09:33 PM
Congrates[cheers] ,I have seen nothing but good things come outta ya,even razzed ya couple times,keep up the good work man...



I have some input for ya,but my little helions are getting in bed,will post some idea's later,once again,good work and I hope your plans can take effect.If I saw $$$ going to the right places,I dont mind putting in at all.

highwaystar
04-03-2007, 09:44 PM
Will you be involved in the okanagan at all? Weve taken quite a hit recently with the proposition of making everything from oliver south a "grassland protected park", The "little white" fiasco, summerland drainage mudbogging, and more recently mudbogging up ranchlands.

The solution in this neck of the woods seems to be the push to get "ATV's" liscenced. While its nice in a way that ATVs are getting all the blame from the generally clueless public, "Mudboggers" are popping up in the news alot more. Perhaps you could form a good alliance with a B.C Quading association as its definetly a shared problem.

Maybe your association should set up chapters of members in each city who are able to assist with search and rescue and emergency situations where 4x4s are needed. Hikers in BMWs are less likely to frown at a muddy truck if it has a big "Volunteer Search and Rescue" lisence plate on it with a 4WDABC emblem perhaps.

Maybe somehow have an agreement with police that members of the 4WDABC pledge to only safely modify their trucks so that members displaying the sticker are less likely to get VI's somehow.

Tree huggers will always hate us, but they are also extremely lazy and dumb, and will only complain until they figure someone else is doing something about things. Maybe a little publicity that you are trying to make a difference will get alot of people off our case?


Also for the record, I think your idea of two groups of wheelers is very correct, and the other group is a wise one to include.

It would be nice to see other chapters in different parts of the province also.

Anyways just some babbling, Its great that you are enthusiastic about your position, and best of luck! Ill join when Im not broke someday.

Roy
04-03-2007, 10:14 PM
Congrats on the new position!

73
Roy VE7IBJ

MikeWild
04-03-2007, 11:19 PM
I'm sorry if I come across as being difficult, but when you say:

There are a lot of people out there who use 4x4 to get to their fishing spots...to go sledding....to drop their ATV off

(And please I hope nobody takes offence as that is not my intent) I have to question this premise, in my opinion; these are two very different and diverse groups. You may as well include those that take a 4x4 to go to their nearest Safeway store. I think that forums such as this have a group of people that think differently than those who use a 4x4 as a means to get them to where they can off load their weekend entertainment. Again, please donít get me wrong when I say that those of us who 4x4 ĎASí the recreation tend to be more concerned over the trails that we frequent than perhaps the fringe groups, I donít want to place labels, but when I think of the four wheel drive association of BC, I think it should represent the group that wheels ĎASí the recreation. Iím sure everyone shares the same sentiment, only some of us Ďseemí to care more than others. (again, not that the other groups donít care, but I think their agendas are a tad different)

Cheeky
04-03-2007, 11:47 PM
I'm sorry if I come across as being difficult, but when you say:

There are a lot of people out there who use 4x4 to get to their fishing spots...to go sledding....to drop their ATV off

(And please I hope nobody takes offence as that is not my intent) I have to question this premise, in my opinion; these are two very different and diverse groups. You may as well include those that take a 4x4 to go to their nearest Safeway store. I think that forums such as this have a group of people that think differently than those who use a 4x4 as a means to get them to where they can off load their weekend entertainment. Again, please donít get me wrong when I say that those of us who 4x4 ĎASí the recreation tend to be more concerned over the trails that we frequent than perhaps the fringe groups, I donít want to place labels, but when I think of the four wheel drive association of BC, I think it should represent the group that wheels ĎASí the recreation. Iím sure everyone shares the same sentiment, only some of us Ďseemí to care more than others. (again, not that the other groups donít care, but I think their agendas are a tad different)




Mike---I work with 300 guys for 14 years,alot of them have 4wdabc from many years ago on there trucks,they are all fishing/hunting guys,no lifts or mud tires on there trucks.I thinks what he is doing here is showing that the "orginization"is stepping up to try and save what has (imo)been failing to keep thier promisses to the members:dontknow:



If it was just up to us "WHEELERS",well there is not much $$$$ raised to run this site never the less pay for POLITICAL bullshit.I hear what your saying, and to a degree i do agree with ya[cheers] I would love to only have secret places that only Samson could fit(and prob you couldnt)but than we couldnt hang[cheers]


Anyway,this fellow has steped up to the plate, and I think our "WAY OF WHEELIN" could rub off and benefit to our advantage[36]


























And if not well,we can carry on as usual:D

MikeWild
04-04-2007, 12:04 AM
Thanks Cheeky for clarifying, I didn't mean to offend anyone, and again, I didn't mean to say all lifted trucks care more than any particular group, besides being a recent immigrant from Alberta, I don't know everything, (give me time, I'm working on it :D ) I'm just expressing concern over the trails that we 'all' love to enjoy, and I'd hate to see any group dissagree with what I hope we all want to acheive. [cheers]

Good luck and congrats Steve.

Kinslayer
04-04-2007, 12:47 AM
Thanks Cheeky for clarifying, I didn't mean to offend anyone, and again, I didn't mean to say all lifted trucks care more than any particular group, besides being a recent immigrant from Alberta, I don't know everything, (give me time, I'm working on it :D ) I'm just expressing concern over the trails that we 'all' love to enjoy, and I'd hate to see any group dissagree with what I hope we all want to acheive. [cheers]

Good luck and congrats Steve.


I think what you are trying to say is that it is only natural for the people who use the wheeling trails as recreation to care for the trails themselves more. Just like the people who drive their boats to the boat launch care for the lake more than the road they took to get to the lake.

I think what Steve here is saying is that to keep places like Sylvester road and Burma road open to the public everyone who cares about being able to use those places for recreation need to band together under a common banner - to gain understanding of each other and develop respect of each other.

Somehow I doubt that us 'wheelers' care about the ROAD any more than the boaters care about the ROAD, it's just that they turn left to go down to the boat launch, and we turn right to go up the wheeling trail. And the Quadders rip all over the place having fun the entire time.

trevyota
04-04-2007, 01:08 AM
[cheers] seems like theres been a huge direction of change the past 1 1/2 years. Towards the right thing to do. Of course we don't want trails shut down but it seems like certin trails/camping spots are too easy to get a car into that people will burn/leave there.

Use hale/davis As a example. They should make them only 4x4 accessable so we won't have to worry as much about the idiots going down there making a mess etc.

just a little idea but keep up the good work [cheers]

4x4 only doesnt change the fact that idiot's can still get in...


any idiot can buy something good enough.:dontknow:

Murd0c
04-04-2007, 08:43 AM
4x4 only doesnt change the fact that idiot's can still get in...


any idiot can buy something good enough.:dontknow:

I said that because it will discourage the idiots to go some where else because they won't want take the time to get down to a camping spot etc.







ggget iit or do I nneed to ttalk slooower forr you[f]

sdillen
04-04-2007, 12:08 PM
i have tryed to get in but i simply never get an email or anything saying i can join

I'm guilty as charged. We're fixing that....I know that communication with members (and potential members) has been a real problem for years. We're in the middle of migrating our web site to a new home and the first order of business after that is to streamline the joining process. As far as the communication -- all I can say is that I know about the problem and WILL ensure that it's fixed.

sdillen
04-04-2007, 12:09 PM
?????? are you saying that the association is looking for membership from people that have 4X4 on the side of their street truck?

Got Ridgeline? Like camping? Want to support what we're doing? Have ideas about how we can do a better job? Join us!

sdillen
04-04-2007, 12:15 PM
Will you be involved in the okanagan at all? Weve taken quite a hit recently with the proposition of making everything from oliver south a "grassland protected park", The "little white" fiasco, summerland drainage mudbogging, and more recently mudbogging up ranchlands.

The solution in this neck of the woods seems to be the push to get "ATV's" liscenced. While its nice in a way that ATVs are getting all the blame from the generally clueless public, "Mudboggers" are popping up in the news alot more. Perhaps you could form a good alliance with a B.C Quading association as its definetly a shared problem.

Maybe your association should set up chapters of members in each city who are able to assist with search and rescue and emergency situations where 4x4s are needed. Hikers in BMWs are less likely to frown at a muddy truck if it has a big "Volunteer Search and Rescue" lisence plate on it with a 4WDABC emblem perhaps.

Maybe somehow have an agreement with police that members of the 4WDABC pledge to only safely modify their trucks so that members displaying the sticker are less likely to get VI's somehow.

Tree huggers will always hate us, but they are also extremely lazy and dumb, and will only complain until they figure someone else is doing something about things. Maybe a little publicity that you are trying to make a difference will get alot of people off our case?


Also for the record, I think your idea of two groups of wheelers is very correct, and the other group is a wise one to include.

It would be nice to see other chapters in different parts of the province also.

Anyways just some babbling, Its great that you are enthusiastic about your position, and best of luck! Ill join when Im not broke someday.

These are exactly the types of comments I'm looking for. I realize that we can't expand into all of these roles this year (this year is a transition....pulling out of a 'tailspin' and setting the direction for future growth), but I really want us to be grow until we are able to be an active participant in the types of situations you describe across the entire province.

Alliances/partnerships is my main focus this year along with an increase in confidence in what we are (which will hopefully drive a membership growth).

sdillen
04-04-2007, 12:23 PM
I hope nobody takes offence as that is not my intent) I have to question this premise, in my opinion; these are two very different and diverse groups. You may as well include those that take a 4x4 to go to their nearest Safeway store. I think that forums such as this have a group of people that think differently than those who use a 4x4 as a means to get them to where they can off load their weekend entertainment. Again, please donít get me wrong when I say that those of us who 4x4 ĎASí the recreation tend to be more concerned over the trails that we frequent than perhaps the fringe groups, I donít want to place labels, but when I think of the four wheel drive association of BC, I think it should represent the group that wheels ĎASí the recreation. Iím sure everyone shares the same sentiment, only some of us Ďseemí to care more than others. (again, not that the other groups donít care, but I think their agendas are a tad different)

No offense taken! As I said, I value comments! My take on this is that there are a LOT of clubs and groups out here that really cater to those of us who view 4x4 AS the recreation. I am NOT suggesting that the 4WDABC will be ignoring or changing views/support for those, but more that the association will 'partner' with those clubs/organizations to focus on the specific trails. My goal is to offer an opportunity to include those who don't really fit into the existing club structure.

The thing is, I think that there are a lot of people out there that support what we're doing, who hunt/fish/ski/hike/etc, but who don't really want to get directly involved with the politics. What I want is to have these names behind the association. I think the association will be much more respected if we have hundreds of "mainstream" members behind us. As it is (and I realize there are a lot of reasons that our membership is low, and will be doing my best to fix a lot of that this year) we have significantly fewer members than we need in order to carry some clout.

sdillen
04-04-2007, 12:29 PM
I thinks what he is doing here is showing that the "orginization"is stepping up to try and save what has (imo)been failing to keep thier promisses to the members:dontknow:

Yes. We've screwed up. I want to fix that. There is a lot of potential in the 4WDABC if we (the wheelers) can gain the support to carry some clout in seeking our objectives.

And if not well,we can carry on as usual:D

Yep -- as they say, we've nothing to lose from trying something different!

sdillen
04-04-2007, 12:32 PM
I'm just expressing concern over the trails that we 'all' love to enjoy, and I'd hate to see any group dissagree with what I hope we all want to acheive.

I'm not interested in changing access to any of our trails....I don't want to publish locations or really change the fact that most of the trails are somewhat "managed" by various clubs....and are shared based on who you know and as people realize that you're not going to destroy the trail. The only trails that I'd even consider "officially" publishing from a 4WDABC standpoint are those where we have an official government rec-site at the end. And, in publishing, that means we're going to be following the trail and "unpaving" it as people flatten it....and we'll get to pick up the garbage. That's a lot of work, but I think it's worth it in terms of increasing the "legitimacy" of our "type" of four wheeling.

Bounty Hunter
04-07-2007, 01:36 PM
I'm still new to 4x4ing but this sound like something that could work. Last year while hunting I found three vehicles way off the main roads. Two of them where abandoned and one turned out to be stolen. After reporting these them to the RCMP they asked me to help them find the stolen one(it's fun wheelin with them). They really liked the idea that a hunter/wheeler was helping keep the "bush" cleaner. I definatly think that having a sticker on a
4x4 when going up there with them would have gone a long ways. I really hope you can start a chapter up here in the okanaga valley. I know theres other like minded people around here.

4doorShorty
04-11-2007, 09:05 AM
the okanagan is getting very full of 'fruit' with all the recent growth....
I spent the first 20 years of my life there. My favorite spot in the 'buck got dug out and turned into a pond with a subdivision built around it. Then some homos who live in those houses complain at me that Im tearing up the environment around them. Stupid. There are stupid, ignorant ppl everywhere.....the only way to educate them is to continuosly have positive media support.
I read the postil lake cleanup thread in the events forum. it seems to me that even though some people have a rightful basis to believe that publicizing such an event could turn negative, arent helping to change the outlook...
Like I said, the only way to change the mind of ignorant people is to throw it non stop in their face so their is no ignoring the fact that not all 4wd enthusiasts are bad.
Something I would like to see is more club memberships, whatever club it may be. Also more publicity/advertising of the group...in general, people who take the time and become a member of an organization are considered to be more inclined to promote proper forest usage imo (not to say the others dont).

I also agree that all outdoor enthusiasts need to cobble together...I know many people who like to quad and sled, and have mildy lifted 4x4s to get them and their quads/bikes around....some people like ford, some people like chev....just like some people like steering wheels, and some like handle bars. You get the point.

Thats all I have to rant about, my brainwave ended.

sdillen
04-12-2007, 08:59 AM
the okanagan is getting very full of 'fruit' with all the recent growth....
I spent the first 20 years of my life there. My favorite spot in the 'buck got dug out and turned into a pond with a subdivision built around it. Then some homos who live in those houses complain at me that Im tearing up the environment around them. Stupid. There are stupid, ignorant ppl everywhere.....the only way to educate them is to continuosly have positive media support.
I read the postil lake cleanup thread in the events forum. it seems to me that even though some people have a rightful basis to believe that publicizing such an event could turn negative, arent helping to change the outlook...
Like I said, the only way to change the mind of ignorant people is to throw it non stop in their face so their is no ignoring the fact that not all 4wd enthusiasts are bad.
Something I would like to see is more club memberships, whatever club it may be. Also more publicity/advertising of the group...in general, people who take the time and become a member of an organization are considered to be more inclined to promote proper forest usage imo (not to say the others dont).

I also agree that all outdoor enthusiasts need to cobble together...I know many people who like to quad and sled, and have mildy lifted 4x4s to get them and their quads/bikes around....some people like ford, some people like chev....just like some people like steering wheels, and some like handle bars. You get the point.

Thats all I have to rant about, my brainwave ended.

Membership -- The 4WDABC is somewhat limited by provincial legislation in this area. At present a "corporation" (read registered society) can be a member due to restrictions around voting delegation. I'm working on introducing some bylaw changes that will allow a non-registered club to join as a "supporting organization". I believe an increased roster (of clubs, individuals and companies) lends a high degree of legitimacy to the Association -- and as you said makes it more likely that our voice will be listened to.

Publicity. I intend to get the 4wdabc into the news media this year. We have a lot of trail cleanups and rec-site maintenance events.....I believe we need to get a positive image out to the world.

sdillen
04-12-2007, 09:03 AM
I'm still new to 4x4ing but this sound like something that could work. Last year while hunting I found three vehicles way off the main roads. Two of them where abandoned and one turned out to be stolen. After reporting these them to the RCMP they asked me to help them find the stolen one(it's fun wheelin with them). They really liked the idea that a hunter/wheeler was helping keep the "bush" cleaner. I definatly think that having a sticker on a
4x4 when going up there with them would have gone a long ways. I really hope you can start a chapter up here in the okanaga valley. I know theres other like minded people around here.

What clubs are up there? Are any interested in incorporating as a society? If so, they can certainly join the association as a member club. Individual members can also drive these activities in your area.

Ultimately, I want to see the Association have representation across the province...my lower mainland focus of 2007 is simply a result of doing the work where the majority of our volunteers are!