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Blasted
12-27-2004, 07:51 PM
This is a copied statement from another Zuki site. Posted by Shogun recently.
"Thought we'd finally get around to posting the pics of our 1997 4 door Tracker we finished lifting about a week ago. This truck carries our 7" combo lift which clears 31s / 32s with no trimming. It utilizes our 4" coilover suspension lift and 3" body. The 4" kit includes coilovers front and springs and shocks rear, and all hardware needed. It is completly bolt in, no cutting. Will fit 30s suspension only, no trimming.
Lift is just out of prototype stage and into production. There is also stage 2, coming in the new year, that has custom A arms which provide 1" more lift and relocate axle 1 inch forward. Stage 3, late in the year, 2" more lift. All bolt on and are upgrades from stage 1, you can add at any time. The most common thing we hear is how nice the ride is, literally takes speed bumps better than a minivan. Street drive is awesome, and offroad capabilities excellent."
Again this is a repost from another site. There are some pics posted too but i dont know how to get them posted. ( nor do i wish to catch sh!t for doing so.)
I sent an email to Shogun Samurai and the "Rough estimate" is around 1200 bucks. They are hoping to have the 1-3 stage up and runnin in a couple of months.
Just thought the Suzuki forum would like to know.

DOH... Need a tow.

Casper
12-28-2004, 06:08 AM
Post the link, and we can see the pics there....

----------------
"Shit Happens... It Just Happens To Me More Often!"

Suzuki: Because We Have Nothing To Compensate For!

Casper
12-28-2004, 12:22 PM
http://www.zukiworld.com/cgi/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=suzuki_talk;action=display;num=11036 10480


Nevermind. Found it myself.

----------------
"Shit Happens... It Just Happens To Me More Often!"

Suzuki: Because We Have Nothing To Compensate For!

Tuner Inside
12-28-2004, 08:34 PM
Sorry to not sound impressed. Pull of a bolt on SAS I would be impressed but another macpherson strut setup! Give me a fucking break. I personally have the calmini kit, best thing going besides an sas. But would someone make the rest of the parts that fail. Start with a complete steering linkage setup ( 3 idler arms I have gone thru) and then we need a good front axle housing using a rear center section and next would be a good set of cv shafts.

Im damn near temped to keep my IFS in just so I can make it damn near bomb proof so I don't have to replace a cv shaft or fornt axle housing or fix the alignment after every trail run.

So I can't really see building a kit, cause you cant beat calminis design.

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<center>When Will We Ever Finish All These Projects!</center>
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~A~
12-29-2004, 04:19 AM
[iagree]


[!]sidekick IFS lifts
Stock CVs suck :assshake:
Any one can make a lift that will look good parked motionless on pavement.
I'd like to see this thing wheeled and stay in one piece...

Casper
12-29-2004, 06:38 AM
Bomb proof CV's are in the works (and have been for some time....) and Sky Manufacturing has an upgraded idler arm available.

----------------
"Shit Happens... It Just Happens To Me More Often!"

Suzuki: Because We Have Nothing To Compensate For!

Tuner Inside
12-29-2004, 05:13 PM
Well I plan to run the SKY arm as I am tired of bending stock ones but doing it double sheer. Then we will find the next weakest link. Not to sure exactly waht it will be? Don't really think the links will bend, might be a steering box failure or even a tie rod end?

Going to cough up the 700 bucks for the anvil and run a sami third with a custom mount on the pinion.

As for the CV shafts I have an idea I want to try. I have yet to blow up a cv shaft(stock,) I just pull them apart due to the longer Calmini A Arms. SO I am going to try my idea and If it works I will let everyone know.

So that should cure all my IFS problems.

So when all is said and done I will be running 76.8:1 crawl ratio with the diesel and 3spd auto and the stock kick case and a stock sami case and 5.13 r&p's. Plus infinite fist gear due to the auto. And on 33's. Might have to go to 35's but I really dont want to.

Oh if you plan on running a lifted IFS system put a strut tower stabilizer in!

Just my thoughts.

<center>http://www.members.shaw.ca/hreidie/Caterpillar.gif</center>
<center>When Will We Ever Finish All These Projects!</center>
<center>Revolution!!!!</center>

~A~
12-29-2004, 05:29 PM
quote:Originally posted by Tuner Inside

Well I plan to run the SKY arm as I am tired of bending stock ones but doing it double sheer. Then we will find the next weakest link. Not to sure exactly waht it will be? Don't really think the links will bend, might be a steering box failure or even a tie rod end?

Going to cough up the 700 bucks for the anvil and run a sami third with a custom mount on the pinion.

As for the CV shafts I have an idea I want to try. I have yet to blow up a cv shaft(stock,) I just pull them apart due to the longer Calmini A Arms. SO I am going to try my idea and If it works I will let everyone know.

So that should cure all my IFS problems.

So when all is said and done I will be running 76.8:1 crawl ratio with the diesel and 3spd auto and the stock kick case and a stock sami case and 5.13 r&p's. Plus infinite fist gear due to the auto. And on 33's. Might have to go to 35's but I really dont want to.

Oh if you plan on running a lifted IFS system put a strut tower stabilizer in!

Just my thoughts.

<center>http://www.members.shaw.ca/hreidie/Caterpillar.gif</center>
<center>When Will We Ever Finish All These Projects!</center>
<center>Revolution!!!!</center>



I know it wouldn't be as much of a sense of acomplishment but all the time and dough you need to spend to make IFS work does not justify the result you'll get in the end (as compared to SAS).
Even if you resolve the CV streatch issue (probably by means of some sort of spacer) you will still face very limited travel range from it.

So it would be a neat thing to have finally make a bulet proof IFS setup in a kick, but the reality is that those who try spend years and thousands on it and no-one has sucseeded yet!!![e]
And even if you do you will end up with an inferior (to SAS) set up.

So the question remains: WHY????

If you want to race the thing then I gues it's the rigth aproach. You evidently don't wanna race it - diesel - so again: why?
Throw a D44 and some 5.13s to match your rear and call it a day!

sj-x 500
12-29-2004, 06:13 PM
why use a d44.... ujoints blow. non uniform velocity breaks more shit then anything else. the only really viably alternative to ifs, would be a modified toyota or suzuki axle. some people bad mouth birfs, but as far as i'm concerned, i've yet to see one break for my self, and everyone i've heard of breaking was due to the same reason. d44's on the other hand seem to puke a shaft out every other trip, or a u-joint or 2, or a ball joint... christ, trying to make LESS shit to break, the d44's often times seem like more of a pain to be constantly re building then the ifs.

Zuk's on Ice.

Blasted
12-29-2004, 10:01 PM
So many good points made.. Hopefully the peeps doing custom work see this one. I agree. a bolt on SAS would be sweet, If there was a way to pull it off that would make it tough as nails. That would be perfection. Im not really sure if going anything more than 3 or 4" in suspension is really needed. I mean Im not going to go rock crawling with this thing, and if i did there would be a custom tube buggy in the driveway. I havent met anyone with a calmini 2 or 3" suspension system. So i really dont have any real background info on which is better or customer satisfaction. What it all comes down to for me is supporting a Canadian company with Canadian product. Its going to be interesting to see the results with the new lift compared to Calmini. Too bad there wasnt any RTI scale done to show what that lift could do.

DOH... Need a tow.

~A~
12-30-2004, 05:33 AM
quote:Originally posted by sj-x 500

why use a d44.... ujoints blow. non uniform velocity breaks more shit then anything else. the only really viably alternative to ifs, would be a modified toyota or suzuki axle. some people bad mouth birfs, but as far as i'm concerned, i've yet to see one break for my self, and everyone i've heard of breaking was due to the same reason. d44's on the other hand seem to puke a shaft out every other trip, or a u-joint or 2, or a ball joint... christ, trying to make LESS shit to break, the d44's often times seem like more of a pain to be constantly re building then the ifs.

Zuk's on Ice.



[blah]

Bull shit!
1 The shaft size is the same on a yota and D44. If you spit out shafts there must be a reson for it and it ain't the shafts. They will spit out equally given the same operating conditions (IE: vehicle weigth, driving style, gear reduction, HP, tire size, rotating mass (tire weigth) and so on...) Spline count is the same. D 44 has a larger ring gear. If you ask me Dana has an adventage here.

U joint Vs birf
Comparing stock to stock they both suck monkey dong.
5-760 joints (the new spicer joint, not a bling CTM) has solved strength issue of a U joint. If you full circle the clips they don't walk.You can get better birfs for a toy so that's a wash. However the Dana set up gives you better turning. However sligth, still: advantage D44.

The comment about Ball joints is just a clean BS!


In the end all this strength argument brings out very marginal differences between the two choices. But the main reason why kick SAS is better done with a 44 is the width of the axle options and the fact you can "budget" the swap by only swaping in front loaded with 5.13s (available for a 44)and leaving the kick rear in for a while. You cannot do this with Toy.

Tuner Inside
12-30-2004, 06:36 PM
I don't think the gripe on the axles was shafts but the joints. Both joints will blow under load but due to the design of the 44 axle but the yoke that explodes not the u joint. Toyota the outter race of the birf breaks. Sure a dana will turn more but the joint wont rotate under load.


None the less. BAck to the ifs story.


SAS is great and sure I could do it in a heart beat but y? There has yet to be something to stop me that a similar vehical with a solid front axle could do. I can stuff my front wheel to the bump stops no prob. Rear flex is as good if not better than most with longer shocks.

I would really like to go head to head with another 4 dr with a sas and 33's. Would I do a SAS if I could do it over again, prolly not. For what I have into suspension for the ifs I couldn't do a SAS.

<center>http://www.members.shaw.ca/hreidie/Caterpillar.gif</center>
<center>When Will We Ever Finish All These Projects!</center>
<center>Revolution!!!!</center>

sj-x 500
12-30-2004, 06:53 PM
my beef with the d44/d60 is that when you turn your wheel has a non uniform velocity, resulting in shock loads, which puke out the yokes, which are part of the shaft, when they go, you're replacing the shaft.

the steering stops on a yota are adjustable, most have them set too far in. they can be turned out, but not advised with the stock joints. but i have yet to see a king pin blow, yet look around the pics, even on this site, ball joints puke out.

dana's you can't carry a spare 3rd in case one blows.

cost wise, true the dana would be the cheaper route, but if you're doin an axle swap, you may as well do em both.

Zuk's on Ice.

~A~
12-31-2004, 05:14 AM
quote:Originally posted by Tuner Inside



SAS is great and sure I could do it in a heart beat but y? There has yet to be something to stop me that a similar vehical with a solid front axle could do. I can stuff my front wheel to the bump stops no prob. Rear flex is as good if not better than most with longer shocks.

I would really like to go head to head with another 4 dr with a sas and 33's. Would I do a SAS if I could do it over again, prolly not. For what I have into suspension for the ifs I couldn't do a SAS.



<center>http://www.members.shaw.ca/hreidie/Caterpillar.gif</center>
<center>When Will We Ever Finish All These Projects!</center>
<center>Revolution!!!!</center>


Some good points about terain conquering, although I would argue if you tried long enough the similar vehicle with a SAS WOULD eventually aoutwheel ya. Not by huge margin but still. I am willing to put my money on it.
The big difference between the SAS vs. IFS is not limiting the SAS'ed vehicle to the max IFS limit.
IE: Kick's front end is weak. The wheel bearings are made of cheeze. the hubs are made of poo. I won't even mention the stuff you already said is made of tin (diff) and clay (steering).
You CAN fit 33s on the IFS but your reliability will be next to non existant. Put 33s on a SASd truck (no samurai tooth picks please)and things are a "little" different.
Not only that. Both Toy or Dana44 lets you put 35s on easly and with beefing up you can go up to 37s and sleep at nigth.
Now, if you face off a "fully" equipped IFS truck (say 33's) and a comparable "fully" equipped SAS truck (37's) your comparo will not work. The SAS will run circles around the IFS.
I know this is a little different way to look it the issue at hand here, however, this is reality!

Kudos to you to try and figure it out, but I'd rather spend more time on the trail then spend years figuring how to resurect a dead horse.

[f]
Sorry.

LocashMikey
12-31-2004, 08:50 AM
I have the Calmini lift and its ok. Its not to bad for the guy that wheels only once and a while, or doesn't have the fab skills to do a SAS but if you are a guy that has fab skills and goes out every weekend or does heavy rock crawling then a SAS is the way to go.
I haven't had any problems with my IFS and I rock crawl it a little and it is holding together. I think my trailing arm bushings are going but other than that its soild.

Now having said all that if I was to do it again I would go with a SAS run D44's 35" tires get rid of my body lift and go with a long arm four link suspension.

But it all comes down to your skill level to fab and cash flow.

That just my 2 cents[3]

http://www.cardomain.com/id/locashmikey
Locash was in the house
91 Tracker
3" body and 3" Calmini suspension lifts and 32" tires

zuki4x4chick
01-02-2005, 04:47 PM
22 spline + 70:1 + 33's = ouch (it get's expensive)
Better get yota axles for that reduction:)

We used to run Sammy SAS (same spline as IFS) trackers broke at least 4-5 front shafts with 33's and no extra t-case bling.
That's when we decided to get serious, but like locash
says, it's dependant on your $$ situation....


91' Tracker (building) hers
94' Tracker (built)his

91' Tracker (stock)
leaving it alone

*Suzukis continue to impress the non believers********PIRATE

sj-x 500
01-03-2005, 07:28 AM
this is why i've got yotas, longs, arbs, 5.29's, and twin cases. i hate breaking shit. too a fuck load of saving and self denial to afford it, but it's all commin together now.

Zuk's on Ice.

zuki4x4chick
01-03-2005, 10:23 AM
mmm arb's....I am running front and rear detroit fulls...
They will do the trick..:D

91' Tracker (building) hers
94' Tracker (built)his

91' Tracker (stock)
leaving it alone

*Suzukis continue to impress the non believers********PIRATE