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View Full Version : New Changes for the Jeep... It grows...


mUD uCKeR
12-03-2003, 07:17 AM
For those new to my project going on here, i have a 1987 Jeep YJ, you'll have to read into the other thread for what's been building up to now on this. Well, after the engine swap and that stuff finally got sorter out, I ended up with the issue of my Chevy NP205 transfer case front output being on the passanger side of my jeep. The causes a problem, because the stock front differential has the pinion output on the driver's side. I already knew this would be an issue when i did the engine/tranny/t-case swap. The stock axles wouldn't have lasted long anyways, so This called for a diff swap.
I oringinally picked up a set of Scout II dana 44's front and back... Although not as strong as a typical dana 44 because of the puny axle tubes and weak stub shafts, I had decided these would work well for my project because of a reported easy swap in from "another website". I had stripped the housings right down, and planned to install 4.0 gearing into the differentials while I had them apart. When the time came to cut Spring over perches and set the cast into the front diff, I was standing there with the machinst who was going to help me with this endevor, and looking at it and mesuring it up, we realized that the 2 1/2" spring packs used with a Yj would push the U-bolts into the housing really, really bad... I have no idea how anyone else was able to make this work without offseting the diff to one side. We then decided that for the amount of work require to make this "scout diff" to work I may as well end up with something good... So this mind, I figured that a High Pinion Dana 44 with a passanger side drop and the width of a wagonner would be perfect... to bad there isn't such a thing... so we decided to build one... Started with a 1978 Ford turd HP44 with radius arm knuckles... we cut the long tube down to the length of the waggoneer short tube... no problem. The other side was a problem. The Ford HP 44 had 2.956" OD tubes... the wagoneer tubes were only 2.75" OD... so it wouldn't fit. I searched down a Chevy 10 bolt housing, and got one cheap... We then pressed the existing short tube out of the ford housing and the 10 bolt housing. The 10 bolt I found had a Tube OD of 2.965"... how convienient. The machinist preped everything, measured, and cut the 10 bolt long tube to length, then machined the end to fit a Ford axle seal. Last night we finished setting the caster and welding the tubes back in... All in all it was about 8 hours of work cutting it all apart until the perches were welded back on to the diff... No bad, for a dana 44 that is 20% stronger than a regualar one, and the width of a waggoneer.

87 YJ, 2.5" BL, 3" Susp Lift, 8274 warn. 31" MT/s, no lockers, and beat to shit.

mUD uCKeR
12-03-2003, 07:24 AM
The next part of the project is to prep the rear axle... I am using the scout Diff for this... Everything looks good, the tubes are still only 2 5/8" OD... but it should be fine i think. The WMS to WMS is about 59" for this axle. I re-drilled the axle flanges for a 6 on 5.5 bolt pattern to run the waggy spindles and hubs up front.
We plan to setup a rear disc brake setup on the rear diff while i have it all apart.
I designed some plates to mount calipers, and picked out a rear disc caliper from a early 80's chevy car... then picked matching rotors that would work... everything looks good, and should fit under a 15" wheels with a bit of grinding on the calipers... no big deal.
I found a dana 44 gear set at pick a part with 4.10 gearing... The carrier is just the open variaty, but for $50 it was a deal... and lockers can come later. I plan to do the rear gear install tonight, I was gonna get someone to do it for me, but at the cost, and fact that I would rather learn myself and just know for next time, I am gonna attempt to do it, with some help from someone who has done it in the past. I am confident that this setup will work well for the rear. One problem I have is that the dana 44 differential pinion is slightly longer that the dana 35... fortunatly for me i thought of this ahead of time, and It won't be a problem... Becuase of the suspension set up in the next post... Keep reading... ;)

87 YJ, 2.5" BL, 3" Susp Lift, 8274 warn. 31" MT/s, no lockers, and beat to shit.

mUD uCKeR
12-03-2003, 07:43 AM
After doing some reading on the net, and some reasearch at pick-a-part in kelowna... I decided to use front wagonner springs front and back on my YJ... The springs are the same width (2 1/2") and the only other difference is that one end of the leaf spring is 2" longer. This is perfect... For one, waggy springs are well know for their felxability... guys in yota's ahve been using them for some while now. The second is that with some longer shackles, I should be able to install the springs in such a way to extend my wheelbase, 2" in the front and 2" in the rear. This 2" in the rear will help with my longer pinion on my rear diff... Hopefully I won't have to re-size my custom rear CV drivehshaft for the 3rd time... But will probably have to. The other benifit to the waggy springs is that the give about 1 1/2" lift over the stock YJ springs... That isn't really a lot, but the stock YJ uses spring under Axle setup... My plan is to go Spring Over axle and acheive about 6 1/2" lift in total. I run 3 1/2" lift springs right now... so the overall change will only be able 3" I can drop my transfercase and engine slightly if it helps, but hopefully the extra wheelbase will alow my to still make my drivehshaft angle work with this much lift. I plan to chop out my rear tube back 4" to accomodate the 2" of extra wheelbase, and large tires.
On the front .. the 2" extra forward is gonna cause some steeing issues. My solution, I will deisgn my own high steer setup. Reloacte the drag link (connecting both knuckles) to above and behind the front diff. This will give enough room on the knuckle on the front to hopefully attach the tie rod (steering box to knuckle).
Designing my own high steer arms is something that has to wait until everything is installed, to get the ring measurments and make sure everything will fit. I have a preliminary design that corrects my ackerman angle, but I have to make sure these will allow the drag link to clear the springs, and the tie rod to mtch the knuckle even with the wheelbase stretch...
We'll see how it goes this weekend...

87 YJ, 2.5" BL, 3" Susp Lift, 8274 warn. 31" MT/s, no lockers, and beat to shit.

muky
12-03-2003, 08:46 AM
holy crap , my fingers are getting sore just looking at all that typing.

You can take the boy out of the country, but you cant take the country out of the boy.

mUD uCKeR
12-03-2003, 09:45 AM
Ha ha... Not a problem... i sit at the idiot box all day for work (Mech Drafting) ... so I can type pretty quick...

87 YJ, 2.5" BL, 3" Susp Lift, 8274 warn. 31" MT/s, no lockers, and beat to shit.

KBB
12-03-2003, 02:36 PM
Rotate the T case. Enough said!


http://www.funinbc.com/forum/uploaded/killerbugsbunny/2003101895721_bart6.gif
he he

mUD uCKeR
12-04-2003, 06:39 AM
I have never run into something mentioning, or someone that did... rotate a NP205... Details...?

87 YJ, 2.5" BL, 3" Susp Lift, 8274 warn. 31" MT/s, no lockers, and beat to shit.

Just_some_asshole
12-04-2003, 05:42 PM
fuckin chevy guys postin in the jeep forum[:0]

carnage4x4

KBB
12-04-2003, 05:52 PM
I think they call it clocking, could be wrong. Go for it, it's just a couple of gears, no pumps or anything to worry about



http://www.funinbc.com/forum/uploaded/killerbugsbunny/2003101895721_bart6.gif
he he

imported_n/a
12-04-2003, 06:04 PM
No Matter what you do to it,, it's still going to be a Jeep

[!]Jeep



Official member of the Jeep recovery Team

85 Toyota Truck,Gm Crate Engine RamJet ZL1 Limited Edition Fuel Injected ZL1 454 ,4 inch suspension and 3 body, 35s bf Goodrich Mud terrains, warn 9500 Winch, Tubular front and rear bumber and roll bar. ARB Front and Rear Lockers.

mUD uCKeR
12-04-2003, 06:53 PM
Nah... I already have my HP 44 built to go passanger side drop... It'll work fine... Just have to find the time to finish putting it all together... As for the chevy guy thing... My jeep isn't really a jeep anymore i don't think... it's more like a bastardized combination of a whole pile of shit. The tub and frame are jeep... that's about it... Everything else is chebby, Furd, or SCout... I even have a chrysler rad in the thing... [36]

87 YJ, 2.5" BL, 3" Susp Lift, 8274 warn. 31" MT/s, no lockers, and beat to shit.

mUD uCKeR
12-05-2003, 07:43 AM
Started designing the High Steer arms for my steering setup. The plan is to do a crossover High steer. Going to be putting the Tie Rod behind the axle, and the drag link in the stock location in the front connecting to the arm.
I am not sure how this is going work. I have the pattern printed out fullsize already, the plan is to cut it from some 3/4" or 1" plywood, or UHMW, and mock it up on the front axle with the knuckles installed and the springs bolted to the axle aswell. This should give me a good idea to if the rod and springs are going to conflict, also to make sure i can keep full turning radius with the design of the Arms. I also have to look at where to position my drag link compared to the knuckle rotational point to make sure i CAN get full lock to lock steering, after making sure everything clears...

One thing i did notice in my designing stuff... Is the ackerman Angle is largely governed by the wheelbase of the vehicle. With that in mind, i wonder if all these aftermarket Highsteer arms are designed for a Full Size Chevy Crew cab with a dana 44, with a wheelbase of like... 100000" or something... or a jeep with a dana 44 and 97" wheelbase. Made me realize that to purchase Highsteer arms not Specific to YOUR Vehicle Wheelbase... will.. FUCK UP the steering... Or really the Turning Radius... So, if you installed High Steer arms you bought, and realized your turning radius went for a shit... this is why. And ... Using a jeep sized arm on a full size chevy, would be just as bad as a Chevy Arm on the Jeep... it's not one of those smaller is better things... The only difference would be that the inner tire angle of turn would be wrong, or the outer wheel tire angle or turn would be wrong...
Did I confuzz anyone yet... heh eh. [2]

87 YJ, 2.5" BL, 3" Susp Lift, 8274 warn. 31" MT/s, no lockers, and beat to shit.

Jeepnut
12-05-2003, 08:51 AM
Sounds like it's going to be a hell of a nice ride when your finished.Good luck with the mods.I know when I started mine it took a lot longer than planed I'd start doing something and have to change it two or three times before I got it right.Good luck.

John

mUD uCKeR
12-05-2003, 11:41 AM
I am hoping it's together before new years... i have to drive to the coast on the 30th, and it's gonna suck going over the coq in december in a YJ with Mud Terrains and only (1) tire spinning... Plan is to prep the diffs with everything hooked to them... U-bolts, springs, oil, everything... even new shackles... Then back my jeep into the shop... undo the springs, brake lines, and drivehsaft... wheel the front out, wheel the new front in... wheel the old rear out, wheel the new rear in... bolt it down... Bleed the brakes.. hook up the rear shaft... hook up the front shaft... Drive jeep to welder with front shaft, set rear diff angle... weld in and done. Hope to do that in a night. might have to drive around without high steer in a T-setup until the steering got figured out... But that's alright.

87 YJ, 2.5" BL, 3" Susp Lift, 8274 warn. 31" MT/s, no lockers, and beat to shit.