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Renegord
02-06-2010, 10:53 PM
Is thier any way to match the bolt patterns on a 6 lug wagoneer Dana 44 ,Explorer 8.8 (5 on 4.5) combo.I know I can change the 44 to 5 on 5.5 but is thier a way to do the same to the 8.8.

FU Toolbag
02-06-2010, 11:36 PM
yes...
redrill shafts and get drums from a f150. should work. try it. Better yet, get a f150 axle.

WagoneerXJ
02-07-2010, 08:08 AM
or get an F-150 8.8 and shorten it :)

Renegord
02-07-2010, 08:58 AM
Thank you for your feed back,unfortunately the explorer 8.8 is already in the Jeep, it has rear disk brakes, 4.10's which is the appropriate gearing, and width. The entire swap cost $350. Based on your posts & I've done a bit more research, I am pretty sure it is impossible to match the bolt patterns and retain my rear disk brakes, which I am quite fond of.

So on to my only real concern, I don't want to carry two spares and I don't want to drive around with a 50/50 chance that I have the right spare. So, does anyone know if there is such a thing as a wheel spacer that would bolt on to my 8.8 5 on 4.5 bolt pattern and yet have a 5 on 5.5 on it. As my wagoneer 44 is a couple inches wider than the 8.8, so a wheel spacer would even things out anyway. The other idea is to have my spare rim drilled with a 5 on 5.5 bolt pattern opposing the 5 on 4.5 bolt pattern and then just use it as a temproary spare, just to get me home or to the tire shop.

FU Toolbag
02-07-2010, 09:03 AM
I beleive aj had a set for sale a while ago. they xdo exist

vajayjay
02-07-2010, 09:04 AM
Heep is running the same set-up with one spare talk to him [cheers]

Renegord
02-07-2010, 09:15 AM
Thanx guys I feel better Knowing it can be done,V-8 going in soon so I want to get that front diff figured out.[cheers]

epic3
02-07-2010, 10:36 AM
why could you not change the 8.8 you have now to 5 x 5.5?
Didn't the ford lightning and later gt mustangs have 5 x 5.5 and discs and an 8.8 rear end?

Happypants
02-07-2010, 11:20 AM
you can do one of 2 things,


you can get f150 8.8 shafts and have them cut to length and re splined, then run front f150 disks and you will be good,

or!

get spacers which change the bolt patterns from 5x4.5 to 5x5.5,

talk to phil (bumpnspin) at tdd designs, hes in chilliwack, hes good shit and has wicked turn around on his product, and he can do either of what you want,

his number is
1-604-316-3270

Renegord
02-07-2010, 11:23 AM
why could you not change the 8.8 you have now to 5 x 5.5?
Didn't the ford lightning and later gt mustangs have 5 x 5.5 and discs and an 8.8 rear end?
I'm not sure although it gives me another solution to look into,if I could slide rotors over the new bolt pattern then I could have the axle shafts redrilled,and go that way.however due to the width difference I'm thinking I might need or at least want wheel spacers anyway,and that route seems very easy and cost effective,as long as thier are no major downsides to that method that I am not aware of yet.:confused0006:

Mr Vic
02-07-2010, 11:27 AM
2nd vote for phil at tdd designs, the spacers and adapters he makes are great product.

i have a d44 front axle converted to 5.5 pattern, rear axle is a explorere 8.8 with discs and use adapter/spacer for the 5x5.5 bolt pattern

FU Toolbag
02-07-2010, 11:37 AM
If you want it wider as well, why not just put in a 8.8 from a fullsize? They're everywhere unlike the newer mustang gt's. Ya get your width and boltpattern without messing with addapters and you're probably gonna be running an offset rim, I'm assuming, and adding a spacer can be done successfully, but your bearings won't like being loaded like that.

Renegord
02-07-2010, 01:50 PM
Thanx to everyone for the help,I'm going to swap the rotors on the 44 with f-150 rotors,and because I only need 1 to 1.5 inches per side to even out the width, the spacer/adapter seems like the best way to go on the 8.8,the bearings may not like it but it is only a yj therefore not very heavy in the back,or overall for that matter,so I,ll take my chances with that.Looks like I'll be giving Phil a call pretty soon,thanx Nick for the reference and the number. looks like it's problem solved,at least until the next one pops up.:D

FU Toolbag
02-07-2010, 07:45 PM
http://classifieds.castanet.net/showproduct.php/product/371517/cat/320

He's got some.

dh_4_ever
02-07-2010, 08:20 PM
Heeps runs double spacers, onefrom 5x4.5 to 5x5, then to 6 bolt. very custom, lots of bolts. it came loose once. that was interesting..

Renegord
02-08-2010, 09:48 AM
I actually already have some 4x4 F150 rotors and hubs (with 5 on 5.5 bolt pattern) as my driveline donor is a 90 F150 4x4,although at this point I'm only assuming that the independant dana 44 and the solid dana 44 out of an older F150 have the same rotors and hubs,they definatly look the same but I hav'nt measured them yet,they still need to be pulled.But that's something I'm going to do anyway,It's just that if the ones I have don't work I'll have to get some off of a late 70's to early 80's F150 which should be easy enough.That said,single 5 on 4.5 to 5 on 5.5 spacers will work perfectly.

Fuzzydog
02-08-2010, 10:02 AM
I had the exact same situation as you - Waggy 44 for the front and exploder 8.8 already installed for the rear. I am still building the waggy 44 and am using chev spindles and knuckles with F150 rotor/hub for the 5.5 bolt pattern, and I got 5 on 4.5 to 5 on 5.5 adapters from Spidertrax. The 44 will be going in this spring

'Balmer
02-08-2010, 10:10 AM
Go gordo go! I can't wait to get our rigs all swapped out and back up the trails.

Renegord
02-08-2010, 10:24 AM
Agreed down time is like torture,although I can still drive mine right now,as soon as I get my engine back from Mr. machine shop everything is coming out and it will be a mad scramble to put the puzzle back together.With our luck yours will probably just be hitting the road as mine comes off lol,however Ithink she'll go together pretty quick once all the prep is done.

Chopstick
02-08-2010, 09:10 PM
umm i didn't read all the posts an i dont know if this was said but if you can find a spindle from a ford 1/2 ton yr 77 then you can switch the d44 from 6bolt to 5 5.5

the difference between the d44 spindle an the spindle from a 77 1/2 ton is the bearings diameter, on a d44 the inner diameter is quite bigger then a ford one. i had troubles finding a spindle so i just got phil at TDD to make me spacers on the 8.8, it worked out good but the back end was a little bit wider then the front.

i'd say try to find the spindle from a 77 ford an go that way cause its probably cheaper in the end but if you want the to get spacers for the back instead then give phill a call

Phill TDD
1-866-921-3335
hes out in chilliwack


:dontknow:

Renegord
02-10-2010, 09:30 AM
Well Heep, you weren't kidding 77 1/2 ton spindles are extremely hard to find,I spent a good part of yesterday trying and thier just don't seem to be any anymore.So I think I'm going to go Fuzzydogs way and use chevy knuckles and spindles,because a friend of mine has a full width Dana 44 out of a 79 chev 1/2 ton for sale for $100.I didn't want to swap the knuckles because I like the way the waggy 44s tie rod sits on top of them where as most others seem to sit below,but I can have them redrilled from the top and then put 1 ton tie rod ends in.So this is my new strategy,but in the mean time I'm going to keep searching for any other spindle that might work.thanx for the input fuzzydog and heep.[cheers]

Fuzzydog
02-10-2010, 10:15 AM
Hey Renegord, I just remembered something that is kind of important.

The chev spindles that I have are from a 1975 4x4, and the bearing size fits the ford hub/rotor. Not all years do - I think it is 75 to 77 chev/gmc 1/2 tons/blazers.
I totally lucked out once when scrounging at the scrap yard and there was this mangled mess that used to be a pickup, but the front D44 was there. I actually had to hammer and pry some sheet metal away to view the door tag to confirm it was a 75. I was only able to get one of the spindles off, but since the 75 chev spindle is smaller than the waggy spindle I got a friend with a lathe to cut one of the waggy spindles down to the chev spindle size. It was handy having the one chev spindle to cross check the progress on the other one.

'Balmer
02-10-2010, 11:19 AM
Hey Gordo, Jeff's Bronco Graveyard sells spindles if you can't find another source.

http://broncograveyard.com/bronco/i-12218-spindle-d44-1976-77.html

Renegord
02-10-2010, 11:32 AM
Thanx man,I like that idea, brand new.I'm ordering those bitches today:D .

BumpNSpin
02-16-2010, 10:12 PM
thanks to the guys who mentioned me...
a double spacer can be done but is expensive... one should also use loctite too :party0010:

but the spindle is the proper way to go...

good luck...

Phil

Renegord
02-17-2010, 09:10 AM
Thanx Phil, I actually ordered the spindles ,they are on thier way. However I will still need single spacers for the rear, and plan on giving you a call as soon as the D44 is installed, hopfully within the next month or two.[cheers]

Renegord
03-11-2010, 11:48 PM
umm i didn't read all the posts an i dont know if this was said but if you can find a spindle from a ford 1/2 ton yr 77 then you can switch the d44 from 6bolt to 5 5.5

the difference between the d44 spindle an the spindle from a 77 1/2 ton is the bearings diameter, on a d44 the inner diameter is quite bigger then a ford one. i had troubles finding a spindle so i just got phil at TDD to make me spacers on the 8.8, it worked out good but the back end was a little bit wider then the front.

i'd say try to find the spindle from a 77 ford an go that way cause its probably cheaper in the end but if you want the to get spacers for the back instead then give phill a call

Phill TDD
1-866-921-3335
hes out in chilliwack


:dontknow:So time for an update , I got my spindles and I guess we were talking about diferent things. I was talking about WHEEL bolt patterns , not KNUCKLE bolt patterns. As it turns out , my 1990 f-150 spindles fit the samed 6 bolt knuckle to spindle bolt pattern as the waggy dana 44, Which means as long as I keep my waggy backing plates, and calipers , I can get 1988 to 1991(at least)rotors and hubs, and it will all be fine(except for the $200 I spent on completely useless to me 5 bolt spindles LOL:ballsmack ). Live and learn.And yes , the bearing diamiter is the same, between the '77 and the'90

Renegord
03-12-2010, 03:20 AM
The moral here is to not jump the gun lol, especialy when you have 5000 pounds worth of spare parts in your driveway ,and your just to busy(lazy)to check first. but if this info can help someone else with the same swap , that's cool.[cheers]

'Balmer
03-12-2010, 10:07 AM
Shitty deal man... maybe Heep will take your extra spindles off your hands...

'Balmer
03-12-2010, 10:08 AM
3:20am? burnin' the ol' midnight oil eh Gordo?

Chopstick
03-12-2010, 04:39 PM
Shitty deal man... maybe Heep will take your extra spindles off your hands...

i would have but i'm stuck with what i got now

Fuzzydog
03-12-2010, 04:44 PM
So time for an update , I got my spindles and I guess we were talking about diferent things. I was talking about WHEEL bolt patterns , not KNUCKLE bolt patterns. As it turns out , my 1990 f-150 spindles fit the samed 6 bolt knuckle to spindle bolt pattern as the waggy dana 44, Which means as long as I keep my waggy backing plates, and calipers , I can get 1988 to 1991(at least)rotors and hubs, and it will all be fine(except for the $200 I spent on completely useless to me 5 bolt spindles LOL:ballsmack ). Live and learn.And yes , the bearing diamiter is the same, between the '77 and the'90

I dunno man, I was looking at doing the same thing but seems to me that even though the spindles will fit, the calipers won't because of where the shoulder is on the spindle. Be sure before you bolt it all up.

Renegord
03-16-2010, 08:31 AM
I dunno man, I was looking at doing the same thing but seems to me that even though the spindles will fit, the calipers won't because of where the shoulder is on the spindle. Be sure before you bolt it all up.
Well I haven't had a chance to bolt it all together yet , but I did dry fit everything , and if it's not going to fit it is going to be very , very close.but the ford spindles I have are identical to the waggy spindles except for the bearing diameter , and the ford rotors I have are identical to the waggy ones except for the bolt pattern , so it seems like it has to work. :confused0006: But as soon as I have time , probably this weekend, I will bolt it all together and post an update.[cheers]

England
03-16-2010, 09:38 AM
Im also in the same boat on this keep me posted PLEASE I want somthing that goes from the 8.8 pattern to match the waggie 6 pattern so that way i can carry 1 spare only also

m j
03-16-2010, 06:21 PM
so how much is this $350 axle swap up to so far?

Chopstick
03-16-2010, 11:44 PM
Im also in the same boat on this keep me posted PLEASE I want somthing that goes from the 8.8 pattern to match the waggie 6 pattern so that way i can carry 1 spare only also

you should see the spacer that i have on my jeep, i have the stock 8.8 axles but because of my spacer i run waggy 6bolt [36], they are alright so far (2yrs now) an no problems. tire stores dont like them but whatever :rolleyes:

Renegord
03-17-2010, 11:35 AM
so how much is this $350 axle swap up to so far?
$350 is what it cost me to do the 8.8 swap. $200 on the complete axle (including useable brakes) and about $150 on assorted other things , like spring perches , skocks mounts , hard brake line , and new fluid. that's a final cost . It was very simple, took a weekend. The dana 44 on the other hand is going is going to add up to a lot more than that. I got the axle also for $200 ,but I think I'm already up to about $500 and I don't have a bunch of stuff still . I think by the time I'm done ,including the locker it will be closer to $1500.:( But what the hell, I'm putting a 5.0 litre in it and 36'' tires on it, so the extra strenth will be needed.:dontknow:

Renegord
03-17-2010, 11:47 AM
Im also in the same boat on this keep me posted PLEASE I want somthing that goes from the 8.8 pattern to match the waggie 6 pattern so that way i can carry 1 spare only also
I'm hoping to have time this weekend to bolt everything together , so I have a definate answer as to whether or not this will work. As it is I've just slid everything on with no bolts , and it looks promising , but if it does not work I will probably just go with Heeps solution. But I will definatly post an update the moment I know for sure.[cheers]

England
03-17-2010, 11:53 AM
Thanks

Renegord
03-30-2010, 04:27 PM
Well , that's not going to work. It was close , but it's not going to work:ballsmack .The old pads fit in there , but new ones will not. They need to be about 3/16 of an inch further inward. So , I'm going to compare the price of double spacers , to the price of modifying my backing plate/caliper mounts , and whatever is cheaper wins. But in the mean time , I'm short on cash ,so I might look for a set of '77 F-150 knuckles (To go with my brand new '77 F-150 spindles) And if the cost is lower than the above 2 mentioned I might go that way. Either way , at least I know the double spacers will work . After talking to Phil the whole double spacer thing seems less Mickey mouse than I pictured it in my head LOL. Besides I need to space the rear anyway. So I will post yet another update once I have talked to the machine shop.:dontknow: